I Am Not an Easy Man Æ ëâ Å’ãÂå Â¸ Written By Alngindabu Beivieve Friday, July 29, 2022 Add Comment Edit noodalls Well-Known Member Bronze Supporter VF Slang Source - Arcadia 51 Article - Kurita Translation - Noodalls Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution Slang About 3 years have passed, playing the VF4 series. The latest product, VF4FT is just about to hit the arcades, and so let's introduce some of the unique "slang" that has arisen in this time. Abare –\‚ê - Rowdyism Player/technique In a limited sense, after having an attack guarded and such, despite being in a disadvantage situation they still attack. If the opponent attacks immediately then the player will eat a counter, but if the opponent goes for a throw then the player's attack will win out. While it is high risk high return, it is overpoweringly simple compared to high level techniques such as ETEG. Because of this, "Moral" players think of this as a dirty technique, and feel its use should be discouraged, however "fantasy" players will enjoy using this technique, no matter how frustrating it is for the opponent. Also, this isn't just a word to describe a technique, but also to describe players that often rely on this style of fighting. In a broader sense, it refers to someone who just keeps putting out attacks. Players who know nothing of the system and just keep attacking will probably have this label attached to them. Otsuya ‚¨’Ê–éÂÂ@- Vigil Player A slang that refers to players who have an atmosphere as if someone had died, at a tournament. Many of them have clouded faces, and droop their heads, the appeance making you think certainly something has happened. For a weak team, when they've lost their energy and just "want it to end" it can be used. The bigger the tournament, the more they're aiming for the championship, the harder they take it when they lose. Especially at SBO, a large scale tournament, where you suddenly lose in the first round it's a big event. Not just the players themselves, but the entire gallery can get caught up in this mood (it certainly happened at last year's SBO). It was first use by the Gosu Akira player Ohsu, and since then has spread through the VF world. Otona ‘åÂÂl - An adult Player In this generation where they can't win against "young men" in focus on movement and reaction speeds, more than watching their opponent and responding they are moving towards focusing on yomi in their matches. Suddenly the age range has become large, and "young men" in VF2 and VF3 are now older. However, in this game where yomi is so important, they certainly haven't lost the ability to win. They also often get above the "young men" by their choice of what moves to use in certain situations from their wealth of experience. But, when their ability to get above people starts to decline, the road towards "old men" awaits. Rasshin ÂÂ@ÂÂL - Squat down and stand up Player/technique At a disadvantage of -1, such as after blocking a standing P, ducking briefly and then stand guarding. By this technique, you avoid throws by ducking, and can also block mids, by creating a condition known as "Fuzzy guard". Explaining it like this gives it a technical feeling, but you wouldn't think this by looking at it. The character simply ducks and then stands. If you repeat it a lot it looks pretty stupid, so be careful. Especially at close range where both opponents are predicting their opponent, and both players squat down and stand together. This is especially dangerous. Tainai ‘ÃÅ'â€Å"àÂÂ@- In the body Player/technique In a fine sense, it means the same as "delayed". It means, even in an advantaged situation, forgoing the nitaku and insteading purposefully doing a delayed attack. Forcing nitaku in an advantaged situation makes sense in theory, but in this game it is week against ETEG and "abare", so purposefully delaying your attack can be an advantage in fights. It's especially effective against "moral" players who favour ETEG. However, if your opponent is an "abare" style player, you'll often end up eating counter hits, so there's a need to alter your playing style to suit theirs'. Also, in a broader sense, it means to "attack at the appropriate time", and was originally used in this way. In the VF3tb times, it automatically happened with a player whose reactions were slow and wouldn't force nitaku immediately. It seems to have originated here. tb gumiÂÂ@‚â€Â‚‚‘g‚ÃÂÂÂ@- A group of tb Player A nickname for players who were active in the game before VF4, VF3tb. At a large tournament, when one of the "new generation" players is beaten down, and the tb gumi players shine, aren't there quite a few players who get quite excited? Currently, the majority of these players are either "adults" or "old men". This is slang that makes you feel deeply the long history of the VF series. Pan nage Æ’pÆ’â€Å"â€Å"Š‚° - Punch and throw Player/technique A simple string of punch followed by throw. It's simple but powerful, and can be used in many places. How this is responded to gives you an idea of the opponent's level. No matter how low, they would want to master the rasshin. Hitori you ‚PÂÂlâ€â€pÂÂ@- Playing alone. Player Normally plays against the CPU. They have none of the communication for yomi, and just do the things that they want to do. It's a new generation style completely removed from the depth of vs. games. It arose as the complete opposite of the new "morals". At this year's SBO, "1P"'s modaekurushimu (=write in pain) beat all three of the "moralist"'s. Fantaji Æ’tÆ’@Æ’â€Å"Æ’^Æ’WÂÂ[ÂÂ@- Fantasy Player Not taking anything from theory, a style or style of thinking of fighting just by their own feeling. It came about as being at the polar opposite fighting style of "Morals". At last year's SBO in the finals, "Moralists" competed with "Bucchake Fight Club" in the finals, with Heruru as the flagship. Compared to VF3tb where "morals" where essential, from VF4 it was a lot more open, and "Fantasy" style players could increase their influence. Also, when "Fantasy" players go bad, they become known as "1P"'s. Bocchitachi ‚ڂ¿â€â€Ã‚§â€šÂ¿ - Standing at attention Player/technique Even in a disadvantaged situation they don't panic, they just hold the guard button and maintain their stance. Because they don't go for reverse nitaku or ETEG etc. it's an awful technique that won't work against any tricks. Of course, it's powerless against throws or low attacks which is a big hole. Then, there's the opposite "bosshagami" which is just ducking. This is pretty much invincible against low attacks, and it also ducks throws and makes them powerless. It's weak against mids and low throws. Moraru ƒ‚ƒ‰ƒ‹ÂÂ@- Morals Player Go for exactly what's guaranteed. Go for nitaku in advantaged situations. Take ETEG and other defensive measures in disadvantaged situations, and so on, a style or thinking style exactly as prescribed in the "theory" of the game. It is slang born from the words of "The gorilla", stating it as the ultimate fighting style. At last year's SBO, he created the "Moralists" with himself as "The great Moral legend." He joined with two players of the same style, "Gamecentre arashi" and "Tsuchikumo" and together they won the tournament (his record was 0-1, but anyway...). Also, this year they appeared with the same team, but were destroyed by their polar opposites, "1P team." Roujin ËÅ"VÂÂl - Old man Player This is the final stage in the worsening of "Adult." Because they really can't react to the opponent's attacks, they can only really get by with Yomi and obstinance. They don't (can't) get lured by the opponent, so useful techniques may not work, making them strong. If their yomi works out they're pretty much invincible, but they really aren't going to get that against everyone. If they keep stand guarding Akira's + (a low hitting, slow move), they're approaching this stage. Wakamono ŽáŽÒ - A young man Player Their focus on movement and reaction speed is exemplary, and they also have clever tricks, these energetic young players. They have a great vigour, and it comes out in their playing. Their experience is limited (depending on the person), which is their weakness, but they have high motivation and lots of free time, so they can progress very quickly. Because there are many players that started at VF4, there are many players who are not confined by theory but instead who use mainly "fantasy" style. The feeling that they're going up against the "adults " and "old men" who prefer "morals" is increasing, and are a little jealous of their abilities. Because of this, when an "adult" or higher player sees a quick executing move and guards it correctly, they're often praised by being called "young". Wakaran korosu •ª‚©‚ç‚ñŽE‚· - Kill before one knows. Player/technique Using many strings and moves that the opponent doesn't know, and so defeating them before they have a chance to adapt. Vanessa, Lei Fei etc. have many different kinds of mvoes, and so they are expert at this. People who don't understand them will say "I really didn't get that" and so it's very effective against them. It's also used of the techniques preferred by "adults" and "old men". Originally, it was a piece of slang born in Nagoya's "Taikoheya" (drum house) but became recognized through the usage by the main player "Souchou". /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Credit for Myke for getting me the scan in the first place, I later got a copy of the magazine myself anyway. This translation is pretty rough, there's chunks I left out and bits where I just went for the gist rather than looking up every word. (It's still fairly phantasmogorical, cough.) The magazine came out in August last year, so there will be a few that aren't in common usage anymore. It's quite useful to know when reading, so that you can make sense of terms like Abare (although I guess only a few people here read the Japanese articles, not boasting.) Having said which, I was considering doing a basic list of Japanese vocab for people studying in school who'd like to be able to read a bit of the Japanese articles on VF. Would there be any interest in that? So Japan has players who mainly play against the the cpu and can actually compete at high level. Hope 1P's around the world can use this as a motivator. Nice read. Great Transaltion Noodals, very interesting, I'm sure each countries got it's own version of each description, damn I hate them Abare's! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif Chill +40 DP Content Manager Shun Gold Supporter PSN: Chill58 XBL: Chill PKG I think I have Wakamono skill with the roujin speed! /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif Good read noodalls. Fantaji for me. Hmm,, maybe I need to slow down and play like an adult?? Well anyway, I seem to be doing well as a Fantaji, but I switch styles now and then. First player? or does it refer to a partilular movie? noodalls Well-Known Member Bronze Supporter Isn't Abare basically mashing? So mashing is to a degree effective, even in Japan? [ QUOTE ] 1P is one player. [/ QUOTE ] No it's not. Once you see the pattern, it is easy to just counter them every time with the right move. Mashers are the easiest to recognize and take out. KiwE Well-Known Member [ QUOTE ] So Japan has players who mainly play against the the cpu and can actually compete at high level. Hope 1P's around the world can use this as a motivator. Nice read. [/ QUOTE ] Well that's another VFDC myth down the basket. I remember the "Japanese players don't ever do downattacks after opponent has lost the round" one still clear as day. Nice read as always Noodalls. /KiwE [ QUOTE ] Isn't Abare basically mashing? So mashing is to a degree effective, even in Japan? [/ QUOTE ] No, not at all. Abare players know what they're doing, they just don't play smart. They don't play a frame based game, and almost always attack on disadvantage. You can usually just own most abare players with , but it's still extremely difficult as these players still have a general knowledge of the game. Occassionally attacking when at a big disadvantage is not a bad idea. You can hit the guy trying to throw you and make them more likely to attack rather than throw in the future, thus making them more predictable. I think it's hilarious that someone could call that "immoral." "How dare you hit me when I try to throw you!" [ QUOTE ] Abare players know what they're doing, they just don't play smart. They don't play a frame based game, and almost always attack on disadvantage. You can usually just own most abare players with , but it's still extremely difficult as these players still have a general knowledge of the game. [/ QUOTE ] Less lip, more hip. (a nice way of saying STFU & play /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif) vanity please do the following. go to training mode and pick akira as your character and, say, jacky as your dummy. set the cpu to guard & counterattack with low punch. now, try the following flow charts from both stances. DE>(ever so slight delay)spod DE>knee DE>shrm DE> SDE>(ever so slight delay)spod SDE>knee SDE>shrm SDE> now you have a lot of info, right? and some of it was pretty counter intuitive, huh? frames are great when they accurately describe what is going on in the game, but the game is not slave to our computations or musings, we must learn to move withing it's strictures & work within it's rules or exploit it's quirks all the while trying to outplay /outguess /outmove /outstyle our opponent. If abare (or whatever) gets you there, then it really isn't fair to say the winner isn't playing smart. Also, if you want beat someone attacking at a disadvantage...think bigger than lp. Let me tell you that my main competition is by definition an abare player. Ramrod, it is cheap because they do not apply advanced techniques. When they believe you will go for an attack, they will usually only fuzzy at best, and if they think you will throw then they will attack. Sometimes I can get about 5 counter hits in a row, simply because his instinctive response is to merely avoid throws, and has very little knowledge of the actual game. For instance, when the computer is playing lau and get's its + is guarded, I'm pretty much used to going for a throw, and hope that I guess right and catch my computer opponent out of an eteg. my brother however, will ALWAYS attack in this situation, since he lacks the ability to deal with the situation in a better manner. (ie, deal with both attacks and throws) And sanjuro, when I talk abour constantly attacking on disadvantage, I mean almost never falling for a jab-throw. even on small and medium disadvantage, abare players will tend to attack simply to avoid the inherent possibility of the throw, despite there being much superior options from a risk-reward perspective. so, if their high risk - low reward tactic manages to succeed in a match, (even if it happens to be 1/10 matches), it can still be extremely frustrating. Abare has nothing to do with knowing how to/not knowing how to do defensive techniques. High-risk, low reward? High risk, high reward. Abare players would attack with a strong launcher or moves with evasion/sabaki properties, and some will mix it up with other defensive things. Chibita, Mask, Mukki, Ohsu are all good examples of abare players. Abare doesn't just mean someone uses reverse nitaku a lot, it also means they are aggressive overall. Homestay uses reverse nitaku all the time, but I wouldn't say he is abare at all; he is very technical. Chill +40 DP Content Manager Shun Gold Supporter PSN: Chill58 XBL: Chill PKG [ QUOTE ] Sometimes I can get about 5 counter hits in a row, simply because his instinctive response is to merely avoid throws, and has very little knowledge of the actual game. [/ QUOTE ] Personally I wouldn't call this abare, I would call it mashing. I think this difference got bogged down in the different definitions of abare. [ QUOTE ] In a limited sense, after having an attack guarded and such, despite being in a disadvantage situation they still attack. If the opponent attacks immediately then the player will eat a counter, but if the opponent goes for a throw then the player's attack will win out. While it is high risk high return, it is overpoweringly simple compared to high level techniques such as ETEG. Because of this, "Moral" players think of this as a dirty technique, and feel its use should be discouraged, however "fantasy" players will enjoy using this technique, no matter how frustrating it is for the opponent. Also, this isn't just a word to describe a technique, but also to describe players that often rely on this style of fighting. In a broader sense, it refers to someone who just keeps putting out attacks. Players who know nothing of the system and just keep attacking will probably have this label attached to them. [/ QUOTE ] In the broader sense the definition would be correct, but (and correct me if I'm wrong people) I don't think that definition has been applied to "abare" on VFDC, which is why sanjuro called out our post. What sanjuro listed was an example of abare used tactically - moves which will beat your opponent not just if they throw but also if they do certain attacks, and that is what I and I'm assuming VFDC think of as abare. I would say attacking at a disadvantage all the time without any tactics would be, at least on VFDC, called mashing rather than abare. Edit: Dandy you freaking ninja posting one minute before me /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif. "so, if their high risk - low reward tactic manages to succeed in a match, (even if it happens to be 1/10 matches), it can still be extremely frustrating." Ahem, high risk - HIGH reward. If you try to throw me and I throw out 33K with Jacky = you dead. Anyway... abare play, like other styles of play, are good in moderation. Lean towards moralist? Eat delayed attacks for life. A little too anxious to get out of that minus situation? Eat MC for breakfast lunch and dinner. Simple as that. I <3 VF. [ QUOTE ] Chibita, Mask, Mukki, Ohsu are all good examples of abare players. Abare doesn't just mean someone uses reverse nitaku a lot, it also means they are aggressive overall. Homestay uses reverse nitaku all the time, but I wouldn't say he is abare at all; he is very technical. [/ QUOTE ] Yep! Vanity, if your main comp always attacks when they have a disadvatage, then it's your goddamn fault if you ever get hit with anything. Attack attack attack until you train em to block. If you get hit, it's not because they are cheap. It's because your ass is simple. Share This Page Home Home Forums Forums Commands Commands Combos Combos Events Events Streams Streams Media Ranks Ranks Wiki Wiki Members Members Menu melroseamonly.blogspot.com Source: https://virtuafighter.com/threads/vf-slang.9211/ Share this post
VF Slang Source - Arcadia 51 Article - Kurita Translation - Noodalls Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution Slang About 3 years have passed, playing the VF4 series. The latest product, VF4FT is just about to hit the arcades, and so let's introduce some of the unique "slang" that has arisen in this time. Abare –\‚ê - Rowdyism Player/technique In a limited sense, after having an attack guarded and such, despite being in a disadvantage situation they still attack. If the opponent attacks immediately then the player will eat a counter, but if the opponent goes for a throw then the player's attack will win out. While it is high risk high return, it is overpoweringly simple compared to high level techniques such as ETEG. Because of this, "Moral" players think of this as a dirty technique, and feel its use should be discouraged, however "fantasy" players will enjoy using this technique, no matter how frustrating it is for the opponent. Also, this isn't just a word to describe a technique, but also to describe players that often rely on this style of fighting. In a broader sense, it refers to someone who just keeps putting out attacks. Players who know nothing of the system and just keep attacking will probably have this label attached to them. Otsuya ‚¨’Ê–éÂÂ@- Vigil Player A slang that refers to players who have an atmosphere as if someone had died, at a tournament. Many of them have clouded faces, and droop their heads, the appeance making you think certainly something has happened. For a weak team, when they've lost their energy and just "want it to end" it can be used. The bigger the tournament, the more they're aiming for the championship, the harder they take it when they lose. Especially at SBO, a large scale tournament, where you suddenly lose in the first round it's a big event. Not just the players themselves, but the entire gallery can get caught up in this mood (it certainly happened at last year's SBO). It was first use by the Gosu Akira player Ohsu, and since then has spread through the VF world. Otona ‘åÂÂl - An adult Player In this generation where they can't win against "young men" in focus on movement and reaction speeds, more than watching their opponent and responding they are moving towards focusing on yomi in their matches. Suddenly the age range has become large, and "young men" in VF2 and VF3 are now older. However, in this game where yomi is so important, they certainly haven't lost the ability to win. They also often get above the "young men" by their choice of what moves to use in certain situations from their wealth of experience. But, when their ability to get above people starts to decline, the road towards "old men" awaits. Rasshin ÂÂ@ÂÂL - Squat down and stand up Player/technique At a disadvantage of -1, such as after blocking a standing P, ducking briefly and then stand guarding. By this technique, you avoid throws by ducking, and can also block mids, by creating a condition known as "Fuzzy guard". Explaining it like this gives it a technical feeling, but you wouldn't think this by looking at it. The character simply ducks and then stands. If you repeat it a lot it looks pretty stupid, so be careful. Especially at close range where both opponents are predicting their opponent, and both players squat down and stand together. This is especially dangerous. Tainai ‘ÃÅ'â€Å"àÂÂ@- In the body Player/technique In a fine sense, it means the same as "delayed". It means, even in an advantaged situation, forgoing the nitaku and insteading purposefully doing a delayed attack. Forcing nitaku in an advantaged situation makes sense in theory, but in this game it is week against ETEG and "abare", so purposefully delaying your attack can be an advantage in fights. It's especially effective against "moral" players who favour ETEG. However, if your opponent is an "abare" style player, you'll often end up eating counter hits, so there's a need to alter your playing style to suit theirs'. Also, in a broader sense, it means to "attack at the appropriate time", and was originally used in this way. In the VF3tb times, it automatically happened with a player whose reactions were slow and wouldn't force nitaku immediately. It seems to have originated here. tb gumiÂÂ@‚â€Â‚‚‘g‚ÃÂÂÂ@- A group of tb Player A nickname for players who were active in the game before VF4, VF3tb. At a large tournament, when one of the "new generation" players is beaten down, and the tb gumi players shine, aren't there quite a few players who get quite excited? Currently, the majority of these players are either "adults" or "old men". This is slang that makes you feel deeply the long history of the VF series. Pan nage Æ’pÆ’â€Å"â€Å"Š‚° - Punch and throw Player/technique A simple string of punch followed by throw. It's simple but powerful, and can be used in many places. How this is responded to gives you an idea of the opponent's level. No matter how low, they would want to master the rasshin. Hitori you ‚PÂÂlâ€â€pÂÂ@- Playing alone. Player Normally plays against the CPU. They have none of the communication for yomi, and just do the things that they want to do. It's a new generation style completely removed from the depth of vs. games. It arose as the complete opposite of the new "morals". At this year's SBO, "1P"'s modaekurushimu (=write in pain) beat all three of the "moralist"'s. Fantaji Æ’tÆ’@Æ’â€Å"Æ’^Æ’WÂÂ[ÂÂ@- Fantasy Player Not taking anything from theory, a style or style of thinking of fighting just by their own feeling. It came about as being at the polar opposite fighting style of "Morals". At last year's SBO in the finals, "Moralists" competed with "Bucchake Fight Club" in the finals, with Heruru as the flagship. Compared to VF3tb where "morals" where essential, from VF4 it was a lot more open, and "Fantasy" style players could increase their influence. Also, when "Fantasy" players go bad, they become known as "1P"'s. Bocchitachi ‚ڂ¿â€â€Ã‚§â€šÂ¿ - Standing at attention Player/technique Even in a disadvantaged situation they don't panic, they just hold the guard button and maintain their stance. Because they don't go for reverse nitaku or ETEG etc. it's an awful technique that won't work against any tricks. Of course, it's powerless against throws or low attacks which is a big hole. Then, there's the opposite "bosshagami" which is just ducking. This is pretty much invincible against low attacks, and it also ducks throws and makes them powerless. It's weak against mids and low throws. Moraru ƒ‚ƒ‰ƒ‹ÂÂ@- Morals Player Go for exactly what's guaranteed. Go for nitaku in advantaged situations. Take ETEG and other defensive measures in disadvantaged situations, and so on, a style or thinking style exactly as prescribed in the "theory" of the game. It is slang born from the words of "The gorilla", stating it as the ultimate fighting style. At last year's SBO, he created the "Moralists" with himself as "The great Moral legend." He joined with two players of the same style, "Gamecentre arashi" and "Tsuchikumo" and together they won the tournament (his record was 0-1, but anyway...). Also, this year they appeared with the same team, but were destroyed by their polar opposites, "1P team." Roujin ËÅ"VÂÂl - Old man Player This is the final stage in the worsening of "Adult." Because they really can't react to the opponent's attacks, they can only really get by with Yomi and obstinance. They don't (can't) get lured by the opponent, so useful techniques may not work, making them strong. If their yomi works out they're pretty much invincible, but they really aren't going to get that against everyone. If they keep stand guarding Akira's + (a low hitting, slow move), they're approaching this stage. Wakamono ŽáŽÒ - A young man Player Their focus on movement and reaction speed is exemplary, and they also have clever tricks, these energetic young players. They have a great vigour, and it comes out in their playing. Their experience is limited (depending on the person), which is their weakness, but they have high motivation and lots of free time, so they can progress very quickly. Because there are many players that started at VF4, there are many players who are not confined by theory but instead who use mainly "fantasy" style. The feeling that they're going up against the "adults " and "old men" who prefer "morals" is increasing, and are a little jealous of their abilities. Because of this, when an "adult" or higher player sees a quick executing move and guards it correctly, they're often praised by being called "young". Wakaran korosu •ª‚©‚ç‚ñŽE‚· - Kill before one knows. Player/technique Using many strings and moves that the opponent doesn't know, and so defeating them before they have a chance to adapt. Vanessa, Lei Fei etc. have many different kinds of mvoes, and so they are expert at this. People who don't understand them will say "I really didn't get that" and so it's very effective against them. It's also used of the techniques preferred by "adults" and "old men". Originally, it was a piece of slang born in Nagoya's "Taikoheya" (drum house) but became recognized through the usage by the main player "Souchou". /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Credit for Myke for getting me the scan in the first place, I later got a copy of the magazine myself anyway. This translation is pretty rough, there's chunks I left out and bits where I just went for the gist rather than looking up every word. (It's still fairly phantasmogorical, cough.) The magazine came out in August last year, so there will be a few that aren't in common usage anymore. It's quite useful to know when reading, so that you can make sense of terms like Abare (although I guess only a few people here read the Japanese articles, not boasting.) Having said which, I was considering doing a basic list of Japanese vocab for people studying in school who'd like to be able to read a bit of the Japanese articles on VF. Would there be any interest in that?
So Japan has players who mainly play against the the cpu and can actually compete at high level. Hope 1P's around the world can use this as a motivator. Nice read.
Great Transaltion Noodals, very interesting, I'm sure each countries got it's own version of each description, damn I hate them Abare's! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif
I think I have Wakamono skill with the roujin speed! /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif Good read noodalls.
Fantaji for me. Hmm,, maybe I need to slow down and play like an adult?? Well anyway, I seem to be doing well as a Fantaji, but I switch styles now and then.
[ QUOTE ] 1P is one player. [/ QUOTE ] No it's not. Once you see the pattern, it is easy to just counter them every time with the right move. Mashers are the easiest to recognize and take out.
[ QUOTE ] So Japan has players who mainly play against the the cpu and can actually compete at high level. Hope 1P's around the world can use this as a motivator. Nice read. [/ QUOTE ] Well that's another VFDC myth down the basket. I remember the "Japanese players don't ever do downattacks after opponent has lost the round" one still clear as day. Nice read as always Noodalls. /KiwE
[ QUOTE ] Isn't Abare basically mashing? So mashing is to a degree effective, even in Japan? [/ QUOTE ] No, not at all. Abare players know what they're doing, they just don't play smart. They don't play a frame based game, and almost always attack on disadvantage. You can usually just own most abare players with , but it's still extremely difficult as these players still have a general knowledge of the game.
Occassionally attacking when at a big disadvantage is not a bad idea. You can hit the guy trying to throw you and make them more likely to attack rather than throw in the future, thus making them more predictable. I think it's hilarious that someone could call that "immoral." "How dare you hit me when I try to throw you!"
[ QUOTE ] Abare players know what they're doing, they just don't play smart. They don't play a frame based game, and almost always attack on disadvantage. You can usually just own most abare players with , but it's still extremely difficult as these players still have a general knowledge of the game. [/ QUOTE ] Less lip, more hip. (a nice way of saying STFU & play /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif) vanity please do the following. go to training mode and pick akira as your character and, say, jacky as your dummy. set the cpu to guard & counterattack with low punch. now, try the following flow charts from both stances. DE>(ever so slight delay)spod DE>knee DE>shrm DE> SDE>(ever so slight delay)spod SDE>knee SDE>shrm SDE> now you have a lot of info, right? and some of it was pretty counter intuitive, huh? frames are great when they accurately describe what is going on in the game, but the game is not slave to our computations or musings, we must learn to move withing it's strictures & work within it's rules or exploit it's quirks all the while trying to outplay /outguess /outmove /outstyle our opponent. If abare (or whatever) gets you there, then it really isn't fair to say the winner isn't playing smart. Also, if you want beat someone attacking at a disadvantage...think bigger than lp.
Let me tell you that my main competition is by definition an abare player. Ramrod, it is cheap because they do not apply advanced techniques. When they believe you will go for an attack, they will usually only fuzzy at best, and if they think you will throw then they will attack. Sometimes I can get about 5 counter hits in a row, simply because his instinctive response is to merely avoid throws, and has very little knowledge of the actual game. For instance, when the computer is playing lau and get's its + is guarded, I'm pretty much used to going for a throw, and hope that I guess right and catch my computer opponent out of an eteg. my brother however, will ALWAYS attack in this situation, since he lacks the ability to deal with the situation in a better manner. (ie, deal with both attacks and throws) And sanjuro, when I talk abour constantly attacking on disadvantage, I mean almost never falling for a jab-throw. even on small and medium disadvantage, abare players will tend to attack simply to avoid the inherent possibility of the throw, despite there being much superior options from a risk-reward perspective. so, if their high risk - low reward tactic manages to succeed in a match, (even if it happens to be 1/10 matches), it can still be extremely frustrating.
Abare has nothing to do with knowing how to/not knowing how to do defensive techniques. High-risk, low reward? High risk, high reward. Abare players would attack with a strong launcher or moves with evasion/sabaki properties, and some will mix it up with other defensive things. Chibita, Mask, Mukki, Ohsu are all good examples of abare players. Abare doesn't just mean someone uses reverse nitaku a lot, it also means they are aggressive overall. Homestay uses reverse nitaku all the time, but I wouldn't say he is abare at all; he is very technical.
[ QUOTE ] Sometimes I can get about 5 counter hits in a row, simply because his instinctive response is to merely avoid throws, and has very little knowledge of the actual game. [/ QUOTE ] Personally I wouldn't call this abare, I would call it mashing. I think this difference got bogged down in the different definitions of abare. [ QUOTE ] In a limited sense, after having an attack guarded and such, despite being in a disadvantage situation they still attack. If the opponent attacks immediately then the player will eat a counter, but if the opponent goes for a throw then the player's attack will win out. While it is high risk high return, it is overpoweringly simple compared to high level techniques such as ETEG. Because of this, "Moral" players think of this as a dirty technique, and feel its use should be discouraged, however "fantasy" players will enjoy using this technique, no matter how frustrating it is for the opponent. Also, this isn't just a word to describe a technique, but also to describe players that often rely on this style of fighting. In a broader sense, it refers to someone who just keeps putting out attacks. Players who know nothing of the system and just keep attacking will probably have this label attached to them. [/ QUOTE ] In the broader sense the definition would be correct, but (and correct me if I'm wrong people) I don't think that definition has been applied to "abare" on VFDC, which is why sanjuro called out our post. What sanjuro listed was an example of abare used tactically - moves which will beat your opponent not just if they throw but also if they do certain attacks, and that is what I and I'm assuming VFDC think of as abare. I would say attacking at a disadvantage all the time without any tactics would be, at least on VFDC, called mashing rather than abare. Edit: Dandy you freaking ninja posting one minute before me /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif.
"so, if their high risk - low reward tactic manages to succeed in a match, (even if it happens to be 1/10 matches), it can still be extremely frustrating." Ahem, high risk - HIGH reward. If you try to throw me and I throw out 33K with Jacky = you dead. Anyway... abare play, like other styles of play, are good in moderation. Lean towards moralist? Eat delayed attacks for life. A little too anxious to get out of that minus situation? Eat MC for breakfast lunch and dinner. Simple as that. I <3 VF.
[ QUOTE ] Chibita, Mask, Mukki, Ohsu are all good examples of abare players. Abare doesn't just mean someone uses reverse nitaku a lot, it also means they are aggressive overall. Homestay uses reverse nitaku all the time, but I wouldn't say he is abare at all; he is very technical. [/ QUOTE ] Yep!
Vanity, if your main comp always attacks when they have a disadvatage, then it's your goddamn fault if you ever get hit with anything. Attack attack attack until you train em to block. If you get hit, it's not because they are cheap. It's because your ass is simple.
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